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NEWS: New Kaleidescape "M-Class" players announced, with Blu-ray support
- Thread starter josh
- Start date
Disc only.
With all due respect, this is absolute garbage. If you own a blu-ray player, I can see NO reason to bother with this. Had I known from my dealer that this was the story, I would have never bought on. Having to buy a vault is just another method of squeezing another 1000 or 2000 or whatever from people into the system. I intend on calling my dealer monday and getting a refund if possible. This really angers me.
Can someone tell me what the point of owning this system is, if you already have an upper end blu ray player? The whole point of this system from my perspective was the ability to pick any movie at any time without having to sift through 400 discs. I don't rip off discs. I don't belong to Netflix, but I don't want to have to go through each and every one of my 50 blurays just to see the movie. I have looked through the majority of these posts and I seem to be one of the only people who is pissed off by this. Am I crazy?
Well, it's not Kaleidescape's fault. They just found a way to enable the functionality you described while staying "legal". It's the law that's requiring the physical blu-ray disc to be present if playing content - not some scam from Kaleidescape. You don't have to do anything with any vaults if you don't need/want to view blu-ray content flexibly via the Kaleidescape. None of this applies to DVDs and CDs.
Again, Kaleidescape came up with a legal solution. They obviously wouldn't have chosen this path if it wasn't required by law.
BTW, yes *MANY* of us griped and complained about the law a while back - but that's all moot now. That's why you don't see a lot of complaints any more.
Again, Kaleidescape came up with a legal solution. They obviously wouldn't have chosen this path if it wasn't required by law.
BTW, yes *MANY* of us griped and complained about the law a while back - but that's all moot now. That's why you don't see a lot of complaints any more.
Echo the legal stuff from above. Clearly the owners of BD content do not want their creations to be copied. K has come up with a solution that eliminates unlawful use.
If its any consolation, for the $1500 price of this 100-disc Blu-ray vault, it is also a Blu-ray disc autoloader. Buy your BDs, slot load them into your vault, they autoload onto your K System, and you're done. Enjoy.
If its any consolation, for the $1500 price of this 100-disc Blu-ray vault, it is also a Blu-ray disc autoloader. Buy your BDs, slot load them into your vault, they autoload onto your K System, and you're done. Enjoy.
Then really my complaint is with Gramaphone which did not tell me about this part of the new system. Had I have known, I would not have bought it. From my perspective I spent 8K in upgrades for a glorified blu-ray player and now am looking at spending and extra 1500 to get the functionality I had before last week. Not a happy customer here. Gotta tell you.
Question - if i upload non blu-ray dvd's into the new system do I have the same issue or is it like the old system?
Question - if i upload non blu-ray dvd's into the new system do I have the same issue or is it like the old system?
For $8,000 I assume you upgraded 2-3 players you had to M Class players. DVDs and CDs still work just like before. You'll notice that the on screen interface is enhanced with your M players compared to other K players.
You've added to your K System (with each M player) the ability to play or load/playback Blu-ray discs.
You've added to your K System (with each M player) the ability to play or load/playback Blu-ray discs.
I just wish the MDV had ethernet connectivity to the Kaleidescape system and dispense with USB completely. The price point of MDV is affordable for me, the price of the IDV probably won't be. Despite my initial reservations I've just ordered an M300, and it's the only M-class player in my system. I just wanted to see what the new UI looks like at 1080P, obviously I won't be able to play any BR content with this configuration.
How good is the M-class player at upscaling DVD to 1080P? I have a MP2 and have forced it to output both video and the UI at 480P/576P to my Lumagen Radiance video processor. I am using the new re-interlace feature of the Radiance, and then sending it out as 1080P to both displays. I have difficulty telling the picture quality apart from BR sent directly to my display at 1080P/24 native from a PS3, it's that good. So I am not losing out much on the video side with this "disc in vault" thing because I'm more than happy with the Kaleidescape DVD solution. Where I do lose out is on the audio side, because the compressed audio on DVD just doesn't compare to LPCM audio on BR. I didn't buy an M500 player because that doesn't gain me much on the audio side compared to what I have at the moment (because it doesn't decode to LPCM!!). So if the M300 is good at upscaling 480i/576i to 1080P I can get it to do that, and I won't have any re-sync issues when switching between movie playback and the KEAOS 4.0 UI.
Note: BTW I need to send SD in progressive scan to the Radiance because the MP2 has an interlace timing issue that causes the Radiance to do weird things.
How good is the M-class player at upscaling DVD to 1080P? I have a MP2 and have forced it to output both video and the UI at 480P/576P to my Lumagen Radiance video processor. I am using the new re-interlace feature of the Radiance, and then sending it out as 1080P to both displays. I have difficulty telling the picture quality apart from BR sent directly to my display at 1080P/24 native from a PS3, it's that good. So I am not losing out much on the video side with this "disc in vault" thing because I'm more than happy with the Kaleidescape DVD solution. Where I do lose out is on the audio side, because the compressed audio on DVD just doesn't compare to LPCM audio on BR. I didn't buy an M500 player because that doesn't gain me much on the audio side compared to what I have at the moment (because it doesn't decode to LPCM!!). So if the M300 is good at upscaling 480i/576i to 1080P I can get it to do that, and I won't have any re-sync issues when switching between movie playback and the KEAOS 4.0 UI.
Note: BTW I need to send SD in progressive scan to the Radiance because the MP2 has an interlace timing issue that causes the Radiance to do weird things.
You only want 1 thing doing video processing. Your Lumagen likely has far better processing ability than anything K has ever built into their players or any other source ever made for that matter. Let your sources hit your Lumagen in their native form and let your Lumagen do its thing. If you have to output a 480i source at 480p so be it, but stop right there.
For the audio 1 thing you could always do is pick up an inexpensive receiver that would decode DTS Master Audio and such off an HDMI connection and output it via its multichannel outs then connect into whatever high-end sound processor you have that doesn't already do this. Ironic that sub-$1000 receivers do this and the high-end stuff still does not (Denon's $7500 processor excluded).
For the audio 1 thing you could always do is pick up an inexpensive receiver that would decode DTS Master Audio and such off an HDMI connection and output it via its multichannel outs then connect into whatever high-end sound processor you have that doesn't already do this. Ironic that sub-$1000 receivers do this and the high-end stuff still does not (Denon's $7500 processor excluded).
Bingo. I hope the new M player will allow you to output 480i for DVD and 1080P/24 for BR movies.
As to this being some evil K scheme to get more money out of your wallet- its true- you'll need to buy more stuff.
This is typical of high end companies. I understand your frustration - and youre right your dealer should know whats going on- but consider this- how many other *legal* BR solutions are there? To my knowledge the answer is zero. Its just one man's opinion, but I really don't think Kaliedescape is trying to make extra profit on this situation. I think they just need to do this in order to engineer a legal product.
KMan, the only thing I would debate is using an inexpensive receiver to decode the audio and then output analog- there will be a noticeable drop off going to analog.
Its my hope that the IDV (the larger vault that will come out after the MDV that will have an integrated player) will have on board high res audio decoding. If not I will find someone somewhere to engineer a solution.
As to this being some evil K scheme to get more money out of your wallet- its true- you'll need to buy more stuff.
This is typical of high end companies. I understand your frustration - and youre right your dealer should know whats going on- but consider this- how many other *legal* BR solutions are there? To my knowledge the answer is zero. Its just one man's opinion, but I really don't think Kaliedescape is trying to make extra profit on this situation. I think they just need to do this in order to engineer a legal product.
KMan, the only thing I would debate is using an inexpensive receiver to decode the audio and then output analog- there will be a noticeable drop off going to analog.
Its my hope that the IDV (the larger vault that will come out after the MDV that will have an integrated player) will have on board high res audio decoding. If not I will find someone somewhere to engineer a solution.
Hi
The MDV Is Kscape's way of helping its client base out of a PITA situation with the BD in draw snag, and in fairness the asking price seems incredibly generous considering its a 100 disc loader. It's probably one of the cheapest pieces of equipment they have ever sold (that im aware of). Well done K!
Rgds
Panamar
The MDV Is Kscape's way of helping its client base out of a PITA situation with the BD in draw snag, and in fairness the asking price seems incredibly generous considering its a 100 disc loader. It's probably one of the cheapest pieces of equipment they have ever sold (that im aware of). Well done K!
Rgds
Panamar
Are K actually selling the MDV, or do you buy them from someone else and load the K firmware on it?
Regarding video output from the M-class, for me it needs to be one or the other, 480i/p or 1080p. That's because when you change resolution going into a video processor there is a delay on the output of several seconds whilst the system re-syncs, and that's something I wish to avoid. So I'd like the M300 to output the UI at 1080P native (which is the only reason why I bought it), and hopefully upscale DVD to 1080P almost as good as what my Lumagen does.
I guess that remains to be seen.
Regarding video output from the M-class, for me it needs to be one or the other, 480i/p or 1080p. That's because when you change resolution going into a video processor there is a delay on the output of several seconds whilst the system re-syncs, and that's something I wish to avoid. So I'd like the M300 to output the UI at 1080P native (which is the only reason why I bought it), and hopefully upscale DVD to 1080P almost as good as what my Lumagen does.
I guess that remains to be seen.
cinelife
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Yes, K is expected to make the MDV available to dealers before the end of the year, but as usual that schedule depends on the manufacturer (although the release appears to be on schedule).
Jim
Jim
I switch input resolutions on my Radiance all the time and yes it resyncs but for me its worth the price to get the best possible video quality. I find the time to sync is actually not that bad.
Its not just the scaling that the Lumagen probably does better- the Lumagen offers the best noise filtering I have found- you have to really take the time to use all the settings. I believe it works better if you begin with the original signal than a deinterlaced and scaled one, which is what you'd be doing at 1080P.
If its only one output than what Ill do for my theater is keep my original K player and add the HD one. That will be a shame- but on a larger screen you really have to get the quality as best as possible. I am continually impressed with the image quality the Lumagen puts out.
Its not just the scaling that the Lumagen probably does better- the Lumagen offers the best noise filtering I have found- you have to really take the time to use all the settings. I believe it works better if you begin with the original signal than a deinterlaced and scaled one, which is what you'd be doing at 1080P.
If its only one output than what Ill do for my theater is keep my original K player and add the HD one. That will be a shame- but on a larger screen you really have to get the quality as best as possible. I am continually impressed with the image quality the Lumagen puts out.
Transepoch
Well-known member
That we "know" of: Plays directly on it's own without a separate M-class player, holds 200 more BDs, and eats up an extra 4U of rack space.
That we hope for: Onboard decode of advanced audio codes and bring about world peace.
cinelife
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⭐️⭐️PATRON⭐️⭐️
Authorized Kaleidescape Dealer
Actually, the units are similar in size (the info release indicates the MDV is 7.3inches tall (approx. a 5U), and the IDV is listed as a 5U unit. As pointed out, there are two BIG differences, and then there is the cost difference as well (justified by the included "player" capability and additional storage capacity).
Jim
Jim