I think this would be self defeatimg. A stiff paywall would indeed reduce the membership and consequently reduce the site's value which would further reduce the membership, free and paid. Classic price-volume-profit problem in first year accounting and economics. Often addressed by experimenting with pricing (increase and decrease) to find the sweet spot. Complicated here because of the free tier. I'm thinking we need to look for ways to increase the value provided by the paid tiers.
-
Thanks for visiting the Kaleidescape Owners' Forum
This forum is for the community of Kaleidescape owners, and others interested in learning about the system, equipment, services, and the company itself.It is run by a group of enthusiastic Kaleidescape owners and dealers purely as a service to this community.
This board is not affiliated in any way with Kaleidescape, Inc.
For official technical support, product information, or customer service, please visit www.kaleidescape.com
You can dismiss this box forever by clicking the "X" in the upper right corner of this message. -
You are currently in "Guest" mode and not logged in with a registered account.
The forum is free to use and most of the forum can be used by guests who are not registered....
... but we strongly encourage you to register for a full account. There is no cost to register for a full account.
Benefits of registering for a full account:
- Participate in the discussions! You must have a registered account to make posts on the forums. You will be able to start your own thread on a topic or question, or you can reply to other threads/discussions.
- Use the "Conversation" feature (known as "private messaging" on other forums) to communicate directly with any of the other users here.
- Access the Files area. The "resources" area of the forum contains many "Favorite Scene" and Script files that can dramatically increase the enjoyment of your Kaleidescape system. Go directly to great scenes in your favorite movies, created by other owners, and add automation to playback of your system with Scripts.
- You won't see this annoying notice at the top of every screen!😊
This box goes away for registered users.
IMPORTANT: PLEASE PARTICIPATE This forum's future — a discussion, and an ask
- Thread starter josh
- Start date
Here is an idea which might generate a bit more cash.
I bought the premium membership yesterday and today I was thinking I should have gone with patron. I went back to see if there was a premium to patron path and there is not. Upgrading to patron requires another full price purchase.
Don't want to over complicate things, but offering paid tier to higher paid tier upgrades might drive some incremental revenue. You would get at least one customer
.
I bought the premium membership yesterday and today I was thinking I should have gone with patron. I went back to see if there was a premium to patron path and there is not. Upgrading to patron requires another full price purchase.
Don't want to over complicate things, but offering paid tier to higher paid tier upgrades might drive some incremental revenue. You would get at least one customer
.
thanks @Kabillyhop. I agree it would be nice, but the paid membership system in the forum software doesn't really have a method of doing that. Guess I could add it and hope that "honor system" would be enough to have users only choose that option if they're already a premium member, but... well... even if it's just a reading-too-quick mistake, a lot of people will likely buy Patron members for the very low price they see.Here is an idea which might generate a bit more cash.
I bought the premium membership yesterday and today I was thinking I should have gone with patron. I went back to see if there was a premium to patron path and there is not. Upgrading to patron requires another full price purchase.
Don't want to over complicate things, but offering paid tier to higher paid tier upgrades might drive some incremental revenue. You would get at least one customer
More importantly, THANK YOU, for joining as a new paid member! Very much appreciated.
Personally I much prefer the large user base instead of a dramatically smaller user base that would result from forced payment. The board would probably feel very dead if it was paid users only.
Thank you!!! I really appreciate you doing this,
And thanks to all the people who've responded to this post with thoughts, an idea, a paid upgrade, or any combination of those!
Hi, I’ve just upgraded my membership. I don’t usually comment or interact much on the forum, though that may change over time. I really enjoy reading the posts and always find the information here both fun and interesting. Thank you to you and the admins for all the hard work that goes into keeping the forum running—it’s really appreciated.
I am new to K as of last month, bought a Strato C and Terra Prime server from a member here, but was lurking on this forum long before I decided to make a purchase. I am not one to post very often in general due to lack of time, but I do check this site daily now since I bought into the K system. I would strongly recommend against paywalling for visitors, it would have discouraged me tremendously from using this site, and I probably would not have bought into the K system or understood what it was without the help of the information on this forum.
Paywalling for visitors will almost certainly decrease the number of people who use this forum to research and understand what the K system is, and thus will decrease the number of people who buy into it. The eye popping upfront cost will deter most unless they really understand the value it can bring, which is what this forum does.
That all being said, I did not realize the importance of paid members to keeping this forum going until after @josh made this post. Decided to become a patron member because of this post, and because of the value I have gained from this forum. I honestly don't think I would have bought into the K system if it weren't for this forum, and I am happy to pay to keep it going. As someone who doesn't (at least plan to) post often, I don't really see benefit to the additional perks for paying members vs non-paying, and primarily decided to pay to keep the forum going that I have gotten a lot of value from as it currently is.
Thank you @josh and @cinelife for all you do for this forum and the K community!
Paywalling for visitors will almost certainly decrease the number of people who use this forum to research and understand what the K system is, and thus will decrease the number of people who buy into it. The eye popping upfront cost will deter most unless they really understand the value it can bring, which is what this forum does.
That all being said, I did not realize the importance of paid members to keeping this forum going until after @josh made this post. Decided to become a patron member because of this post, and because of the value I have gained from this forum. I honestly don't think I would have bought into the K system if it weren't for this forum, and I am happy to pay to keep it going. As someone who doesn't (at least plan to) post often, I don't really see benefit to the additional perks for paying members vs non-paying, and primarily decided to pay to keep the forum going that I have gotten a lot of value from as it currently is.
Thank you @josh and @cinelife for all you do for this forum and the K community!
Welcome to the family.
This is a great place to hang out.
The amount of good information, the lack of clutter (no ads? seriously? thank you!,) the great, helpful, positive attitude of the admins, the store give-aways, the super users who have come on and transformed our knowledge of what’s coming out, and what to expect we will see on K, plus insight into the gear,
As the Beatles once said, “It’s all too much!”
Being a Patron? One of the best values out there, imo! (Assuming you have a K and care about the Kaleidescape experience, of course.)
As the Beatles once said, “It’s all too much!”
Being a Patron? One of the best values out there, imo! (Assuming you have a K and care about the Kaleidescape experience, of course.)
Thank you much @Rituxan for becoming a paying member and that’s excellent feedback about the risks of paywalling.
Working on another solution that may be best if all worlds.
Sincerely appreciate all the new premium and patron members that joined recently as a result of this discussion. Very heartwarming to see the outpouring of generosity and positive comments about this community.
Many sites use a model that includes ads for non paying members and is ad free for paid memberships. Is that feasible here? I think the user demographics here would be appealing to advertisers but I don't know if we have enough daily traffic to interest them? While we all enjoy the ad free site, it may be the price to keep the forum going. Those who don't want the ads can buy a membership and stop seeing them.
You could exclude K and K reseller ads to avoid conflicts of interest or the appearance thereof.
You could exclude K and K reseller ads to avoid conflicts of interest or the appearance thereof.
What prompted me to subscribe originally is the amount of money I've saved by keeping an eye on the Movies On Sale thread. 
What keeps me subscribed is my appreciation for the community. 
This is the only online forum I actively participate in, and I'd be sad to see it go.
Someone mentioned the idea of a membership drive, like public radio, and I think that would be a great thing to do annually or semi-annually to bring attention to the genuine need for paying members.
What keeps me subscribed is my appreciation for the community. This is the only online forum I actively participate in, and I'd be sad to see it go.Someone mentioned the idea of a membership drive, like public radio, and I think that would be a great thing to do annually or semi-annually to bring attention to the genuine need for paying members.
If most members are owners anyway, then maybe this should be a requirement for joining? It is called K Owners Forum after all. Having to provide a K account username for verification at registration might help ease your registration spam detection work. Although not sure if any forum admins are able to do account look ups or if K could help with this.
Appreciate these thoughts and ideas! Yes, ads only for non-paying members is definitely doable, though I'd have to find the right ad network that would value our userbase for the right kind of ads. I'm looking into it. (and of course, everyone has my word that no one who paid even the smallest amount would ever have to see an ad!)
Thanks! And yes, those member-created threads on sales, upgrades, price changes, and new additions are probably the most popular features here. Amazing how much work those members put in to offer this service!What prompted me to subscribe originally is the amount of money I've saved by keeping an eye on the Movies On Sale thread.
Someone mentioned the idea of a membership drive, like public radio, and I think that would be a great thing to do annually or semi-annually to bring attention to the genuine need for paying members.
Membership drives (as this has kind of turned into) wasn't something I considered, but since we're already following the PBS model (you don't HAVE to pay, but we hope if you find it valuable you might consider donating) then we could also do that type of periodic (and somewhat annoying) plea for membership. Will think about that too.
It's tough to "enforce" an ownership requirement, and I do hear from a lot of people who browse here, or even join as a free member, how important it was as part of their research.
It also is worth pointing out how this site ends up with very high google native rankings when someone is just searching for an answer about Kaleidescape. We often index higher than Kaliedescape's own official site/pages. So I do hope to keep offering that to people learning about the brand and equipment.
The funnel has always been free-and-unregistered to learn > free and registered to participate > paid members who contribute to keep the forum going. The % that make each of those steps is small, and I should probably spend more time scientifically working on those two different conversion ratios. This discussion is definitely part of that.
Thanks for the participating, the support, the ideas, and for the new members who have now joined and/or contributed as a paying member!
I added some cover art files I made primarily for my Kaleidescape system, in the Galleries section. I did it just to support the forum, and add an admittedly microscopic resource to the value equation of the site.
I wonder if there were some kind of incentive to do such a thing if that might boost the volume of resources the forum offers? Perhaps another raffle or just a periodic callout, like AVS Forum used to do with their Home Theater of the Month.
I personally would love to see more galleries, cover art, and especially scripts that others have made. I actually love the scripts feature, and would be thrilled to have a lot more from the members to run on my system.
I wonder if there were some kind of incentive to do such a thing if that might boost the volume of resources the forum offers? Perhaps another raffle or just a periodic callout, like AVS Forum used to do with their Home Theater of the Month.
I personally would love to see more galleries, cover art, and especially scripts that others have made. I actually love the scripts feature, and would be thrilled to have a lot more from the members to run on my system.
Last edited:
thanks Edgar! appreciate the thoughts... and contributions.
have tried to highlight and encourage scripts/scenes sharing, and gallery posting. Neither has gotten much traction lately. Funny thing, I originally created the site (over 19 years ago!) primarily as a way to share favorite scene files and scripts among members, back when that was a feature Kaleidescape actively promoted and developed. Added news and general sharing of info as a secondary thing. But scenes/scripts became pretty much a legacy thing Kaleidescape doesn't really even discuss much less develop. They have said "it never got much use, so why develop it", but I think it's circular logic... it never got use because it wasn't very easy or had a good UI, nor was promoted much. Doesn't matter anymore, it's pretty much a dead feature now. It still kinda works, but no one really uses it as it's so convoluted at this point.
We will keep doing other promos/raffles as we're able... and will keep thinking of other positivie benefits for members.
Wow! That’s pretty amazing. Well I’m glad the pivot worked!
I do agree that’s circular logic by K. It’s a unique feature, and even with the clunk and difficulty, it’s the only such system I’m aware of, beyond stitching together clips in Premiere or FCP and running that through Plex. It was definitely a secondary selling point for me in getting the system, and I run a script as a demo of the system when a guest is curious what my theater is like. On that basis, my demo script Journeys gets more play than any other single piece of content on my K.
I do agree if it were less buried and clunky to build, and at the same level of polish and finesse as the rest of the platform, more users would use it.
Companies do respond to customer data. What if we ran a period Google Forms survey of feature requests, and shared that with K, either directly or through our prominent dealers here, and incentivized owner turnout by making all entries eligible for a raffle?
Last edited:
well, i know they do read (and sometimes respond to) posts in our "Feature suggestion" forum area. There may be old threads there about improving scene sharing and marking favorites... could revive those with a new post or start a new one. guarantee they'll see it.
I'm fairly new to K (less than a year) and haven't had much to contribute to this forum, but I am on it quite often and appreciate all of the insightful and helpful information, tips, etc. Like others have said, I found this site before becoming an owner, and it was instrumental in my decision-making process of getting into the K ecosystem.
I have been meaning to pinch in financially, and didn't have a good reason not to other than the lame excuse of I'll get to it at some point... So thanks for the extra "push". I'm happy to join the ranks of those with paid memberships.
This is a great resource. Thanks for all the hard work and dedication you and others have put into running this!
I have been meaning to pinch in financially, and didn't have a good reason not to other than the lame excuse of I'll get to it at some point... So thanks for the extra "push". I'm happy to join the ranks of those with paid memberships.
This is a great resource. Thanks for all the hard work and dedication you and others have put into running this!