Rmarci
Well-known member
The grain in that movie has nothing to do with KS encoding, though. It’s all source grain and since I called them out about the fake grain, none of their new releases have had a fake grain overlay.
-
Thanks for visiting the Kaleidescape Owners' Forum
This forum is for the community of Kaleidescape owners, and others interested in learning about the system, equipment, services, and the company itself.It is run by a group of enthusiastic Kaleidescape owners and dealers purely as a service to this community.
This board is not affiliated in any way with Kaleidescape, Inc.
For official technical support, product information, or customer service, please visit www.kaleidescape.com
You can dismiss this box forever by clicking the "X" in the upper right corner of this message. -
You are currently in "Guest" mode and not logged in with a registered account.
The forum is free to use and most of the forum can be used by guests who are not registered....
... but we strongly encourage you to register for a full account. There is no cost to register for a full account.
Benefits of registering for a full account:
- Participate in the discussions! You must have a registered account to make posts on the forums. You will be able to start your own thread on a topic or question, or you can reply to other threads/discussions.
- Use the "Conversation" feature (known as "private messaging" on other forums) to communicate directly with any of the other users here.
- Access the Files area. The "resources" area of the forum contains many "Favorite Scene" and Script files that can dramatically increase the enjoyment of your Kaleidescape system. Go directly to great scenes in your favorite movies, created by other owners, and add automation to playback of your system with Scripts.
- You won't see this annoying notice at the top of every screen!😊
This box goes away for registered users.
[Buyer’s Guide] Kaleidescape Quality Compared to Blu-ray & other Digital Sources
- Thread starter Rmarci
- Start date
Thanks Mike
I don't recall the version being mentioned when first telling us about the issue? Had I known it was only the HDR10 version, I could have watched it a long time ago because I had downloaded the DV version.
I'm sorry about that. I didn't realize that it was just the one version until I checked with the team to answer @steelman1991's question.
Rmarci
Well-known member
I don’t think so, Mike said at least a month, and it’s only been two weeks since he said that.
How do KS updates work anyway? Do we get a notification directly on the player? It’s weird, I bought my device back in June and still haven’t received a single update, while my Tesla gets one almost every week lol.
How do KS updates work anyway? Do we get a notification directly on the player? It’s weird, I bought my device back in June and still haven’t received a single update, while my Tesla gets one almost every week lol.
They tend to be released on a quarterly basis, and are installed automatically in the background with no system notification, but they usually do send out an email blast when it goes out if there are noticeable new features. I think you should have had at least one update in the time since you’ve bought yours. My system was last updated in August to 10.22. You can double check in the web interface under settings -> general.
Also worth mentioning is that the updates are rolled out in batches, usually over the course of a month or so, and there’s no way to speed up/manually force your system to update early. You just get it in whatever batch your system ends up in for that update.
Rmarci
Well-known member
Yeah, I really can’t wait either. I haven’t used my Kaleidescape in almost a month. 
It was tough resisting the urge to buy The Black Phone 2 today, though. lol. I love horror movies...
It was tough resisting the urge to buy The Black Phone 2 today, though. lol. I love horror movies...
In the last 1-2 months I have bought more discs than I have in a long time since getting K. Moved the bluray reader from the Strato where I was using it for d2d cataloguing back to my PC so that I can start ripping movies again. Also, had like a years worth of firmware updates for my Zidoo since it has not been used in about a year lol.
Rmarci
Well-known member
I still haven’t received the update that’s supposed to come before the major one addressing the block artifacts, so it doesn’t look like the update we’ve all been waiting for is anywhere near being released. I’m not sure what’s taking them so long to release it. Disappointing...
I’m assuming the update before the major one will at least fix the over-cropping issue. Even though it doesn't matter when you bitstream, I also really hope they address the LPCM decoding problems, because it’s not working properly:
I’m assuming the update before the major one will at least fix the over-cropping issue. Even though it doesn't matter when you bitstream, I also really hope they address the LPCM decoding problems, because it’s not working properly:
- TrueHD 7.1 is decoded as LPCM 7.1, but the two rear channels are always silent.
- DTS-HD 5.1 is decoded as LPCM 7.1 instead of 5.1.
Rmarci
Well-known member
It’s truly insane how they can’t even get something as simple as color accuracy right in so many releases (newer ones included)…
Oh hi 2025
- Strong Red push compared to Amazon and iTunes
- Compression ok
slow.pics
################################################################
Caught Stealing 2025
- Red push as noted in the previous comparison with MA and iTunes
- Obvious DNR, poor compression
################################################################
Mission Impossible The Final Reckoning 2025
- Colors are slightly off, especially Blue and Red
- Inconsistent compression. Some shot looks much better than the UHD-BD and some other shots look like trash DNR
- Sign of fake 65mm grain overlay
##################################################################
TRON Legacy 2010
- Ignoring the block artifacts, KS is better compressed than the UHD-BD. Highlights on the UHD-BD have artifacts, KS looks cleaner and has better grain retention
###################################################################
Aeon Flux 2005
- Ignoring the block artifacts, KS seems better compressed than the UHD-BD, but that might be just their fake grain overlay since this is an old encode and FEL shows no difference with the BL on the BD.
Oh hi 2025
- Strong Red push compared to Amazon and iTunes
- Compression ok
kscape sdr vs amazon sdr vs itunes sdr | Slowpoke Pics
Slowpoke Pics image comparison service
slow.pics
################################################################
Caught Stealing 2025
- Red push as noted in the previous comparison with MA and iTunes
- Obvious DNR, poor compression
Mission Impossible The Final Reckoning 2025
- Colors are slightly off, especially Blue and Red
- Inconsistent compression. Some shot looks much better than the UHD-BD and some other shots look like trash DNR
- Sign of fake 65mm grain overlay
##################################################################
TRON Legacy 2010
- Ignoring the block artifacts, KS is better compressed than the UHD-BD. Highlights on the UHD-BD have artifacts, KS looks cleaner and has better grain retention
###################################################################
Aeon Flux 2005
- Ignoring the block artifacts, KS seems better compressed than the UHD-BD, but that might be just their fake grain overlay since this is an old encode and FEL shows no difference with the BL on the BD.
Rmarci
Well-known member
Good Fortune 2025:
www.kaleidescape.com
Good Fortune
An inept angel tries to make things right when switching a wealthy CEO and a gig worker's lives doesn't go as planned. Comedy. Directed by Aziz Ansari. Starring Seth Rogen, Aziz Ansari, Keanu Reeves, and Keke Palmer. Purchase and download today in 4K Dolby Vision.
www.kaleidescape.com
erixon1138
Well-known member
Braveheart (1995) 4K
Changes in this update:
www.kaleidescape.com
Changes in this update:
- Added audio track: English (PCM Stereo)
Braveheart
A 13th-century Scottish hero leads a rebellion against the invading English army. Drama, War, Romance, Action. Directed by Mel Gibson. Starring Mel Gibson, Sophie Marceau, Patrick McGoohan, and Catherine McCormack. Purchase and download today in 4K HDR10 with Dolby Atmos audio.
www.kaleidescape.com
As someone currently deciding between between Kaleidescape/Apple, can someone summarize these results for both audio and video?Weapons 2025:
As i said, I'll believe it when I see it but this is why I'm very skeptical about that Mike update blaming most of the grain loss and quality issues on the player. This encode looks very denoised (or poorly encoded) compared to the bluray, and yet the Conjuring 4 2025 screenshots using the same player, same settings, is not denoised at all and is properly compressed... Also, I hate having to do this but in a PM, Mike admitted they were doing DNR sometimes..
###########################################################################################
The.Pickup.2025:
VIDEO:
AUDIO:
Rmarci
Well-known member
KS vs Apple? Unless KS messed something up with the colors, which they often do, KS will have far better quality in both audio and video. Apple’s streaming uses heavy DNR, which helps reduce compression artifacts but also noticeably softens the image and removes fine detail.
As for Apple’s lossy Atmos streams, they all include dialnorm, and if your AVR can’t defeat it, as many can’t, the audio will sound noticeably worse compared to KS dialnorm-free lossless audio. FYI, I made a test file to check if your AVR can defeat it: I encoded two Atmos DD+ tracks, one with the maximum dialnorm (-30 dB / -1 dB) and one without dialnorm (0 dB / -31 dB). If your AVR can defeat dialnorm, the volume of both tracks will be identical.
drive.google.com
As for Apple’s lossy Atmos streams, they all include dialnorm, and if your AVR can’t defeat it, as many can’t, the audio will sound noticeably worse compared to KS dialnorm-free lossless audio. FYI, I made a test file to check if your AVR can defeat it: I encoded two Atmos DD+ tracks, one with the maximum dialnorm (-30 dB / -1 dB) and one without dialnorm (0 dB / -31 dB). If your AVR can defeat dialnorm, the volume of both tracks will be identical.
AUDIO DialNorm DRC TEST.mkv
drive.google.com
I’m about a month away from getting my new room up after construction and will give the test a try. Much appreciated. 2 questions for you if you don’t mind…KS vs Apple? Unless KS messed something up with the colors, which they often do, KS will have far better quality in both audio and video. Apple’s streaming uses heavy DNR, which helps reduce compression artifacts but also noticeably softens the image and removes fine detail.
As for Apple’s lossy Atmos streams, they all include dialnorm, and if your AVR can’t defeat it, as many can’t, the audio will sound noticeably worse compared to KS dialnorm-free lossless audio. FYI, I made a test file to check if your AVR can defeat it: I encoded two Atmos DD+ tracks, one with the maximum dialnorm (-30 dB / -1 dB) and one without dialnorm (0 dB / -31 dB). If your AVR can defeat dialnorm, the volume of both tracks will be identical.
AUDIO DialNorm DRC TEST.mkv
View attachment 8966
Audio side of things…
-If you offset master volume for dialnorm.. for example 4dB and levels are the same, will they sound about the same?
-Related to that, is there a difference in frequency response, dynamics, between lossless atmos and lossy atmos that you can see when analyzed?
Video side of things
-Looking at some of your posts, am I reading it correctly that HDR is better on KS vs streaming?
Rmarci
Well-known member
I guess, but I never tried that since my AVR can defeat dialnorm... The problem with that approach is that every movie has a different value. For example, Ballerina has an insane -15db dialnorm, Black phone 2 is at -4db, Smashing Machine is at -2db.
I don't know. I'm not really an expert audio-wise, and never really compared DDP and TrueHD for frequency and dynamic differences. Other people might be able to answer that one.
It depends. If color accuracy is important to you, KS often messes that up. But purely in terms of video compression, KS is better than Apple TV 99.9% of the time. Movies Anywhere, on the other hand, has much better compression with no DNR and can outperform some KS encodes.
HDR alone will be the same everywhere unless someone makes a mistake or deliver a trim pass from the master