Special Features/Bonus content/Extras NOT included for some content

[dnoonie]

I just ordered a Strato E. I was excitedly building my Wish List and then...
A major disappointment.
Special Features/Bonus content/Extras are NOT included with the following: Mickey 17, Mission Impossible all 8 movies (major let down), The Martian 4k (already own disk, no need to get k'scape version without bonus content), Valkyrie (really pointless to buy this movie without the feature length documentary that's part of the disk extras), Beetlejuice Beetlejuice, Dungeons & Dragons: Honor Among Thieves.
This is just a small sample from my wish list.

How prevalent is this? Do extras ever get added later? Are extras sometimes included but not documented?

I suppose I could buy the 1080 blu-ray for the Extras, then get the 4k from k'scape...that's too complex, I wanted to simplify my movie experience not make it more complicated.
Thanks for the feedback.

 

[LoveCinema]

How prevalent is this? Do extras ever get added later? Are extras sometimes included but not documented?

First, Welcome to K!

Fellow Extras fan here, and I feel your disappointment. Regarding your questions...

It's far more common today to not have Extras than to have them. I don't know if there's costs involved (likely?) or if they're just a pain to deal with. Regardless, you'll find in general that most customers don't want Extras, and one of the most often requested features is an option to never download Extras. So, we're definitely in the minority.

Extras have technically been added at a later date before, but it's very rare and I wouldn't count on it.

Extras are never present and not documented. If it says it doesn't have Extras, it doesn't.

BIG Caveat here: K is still in an HD Compatibility Update process for the Strato V. During this process, hundreds of films had their Extras removed or reduced. K has previously committed to updating all of these, meaning that there are hundreds of films that WILL see Extras "added", though they're really just returning.

K provides access to a high quality audio and video experience. But, if you're the type to go beyond just the movie and dig into Special Features (Making Of, Deleted Scenes), Alternate Cuts (Extended/Director's), and Alternate Audio Tracks (Mono, Stereo, Director's Commentary), then you're generally going to find K coming up short against a typical 4K UHD/Blu-ray combo.

As an Extras fan, for those movies I really care about, I still buy either a physical disc or digital offering from another store (Apple).

P.S. You will find Extras for The Martian on the Extended Edition. Unfortunately, this version is only HD (4K on disc and all other digital stores).

 

[dnoonie]

Thanks for sharing.
Concerning Mickey 17, who's sale expires in a couple days, I found most of the bonus content on youtube, built a playlist out of it. So I'll be buying that one from K. Maybe I'll save the youtube videos. Anyway it appears all is not lost, it just requires more work.
Mickey 17 bonus content

Perhaps I should start a thread for Mickey 17 bonus content.

 

[dnoonie]

Mickey 17 more bonus content

 

[dnoonie]

First, Welcome to K!

Fellow Extras fan here, and I feel your disappointment. Regarding your questions...

It's far more common today to not have Extras than to have them. I don't know if there's costs involved (likely?) or if they're just a pain to deal with. Regardless, you'll find in general that most customers don't want Extras, and one of the most often requested features is an option to never download Extras. So, we're definitely in the minority.

Extras have technically been added at a later date before, but it's very rare and I wouldn't count on it.

Extras are never present and not documented. If it says it doesn't have Extras, it doesn't.

BIG Caveat here: K is still in an HD Compatibility Update process for the Strato V. During this process, hundreds of films had their Extras removed or reduced. K has previously committed to updating all of these, meaning that there are hundreds of films that WILL see Extras "added", though they're really just returning.

K provides access to a high quality audio and video experience. But, if you're the type to go beyond just the movie and dig into Special Features (Making Of, Deleted Scenes), Alternate Cuts (Extended/Director's), and Alternate Audio Tracks (Mono, Stereo, Director's Commentary), then you're generally going to find K coming up short against a typical 4K UHD/Blu-ray combo.

As an Extras fan, for those movies I really care about, I still buy either a physical disc or digital offering from another store (Apple).

P.S. You will find Extras for The Martian on the Extended Edition. Unfortunately, this version is only HD (4K on disc and all other digital stores).

This is all excellent information!
The Martian: my UHD disk plays fine, it was on sale and caught my eye. It'll be interesting to see what the disc to digital offering is.
Mission Impossible. Unless the "The Final Reckoning" listing changes to include bonus content I'll be getting the UHD disc. The more recent MI films have excellent bonus content!
Dungeons & Dragons: Honor Among Thieves, my UHD disc sometimes has playback issues. There was not a 1080 disc included. I can view bonus content on Fandango. I'll likely get this from K on a good price drop.
The problem is keeping track of where my content is. Is it on Amazon, Fandango, my disc library, K'scape, or did I just subscribe to watch? I have all my 1080 and UHD discs on blu-ray.com that can be downloaded into a spreadsheet, a good start.

 

[Transepoch]

K provides access to a high quality audio and video experience. But, if you're the type to go beyond just the movie and dig into Special Features (Making Of, Deleted Scenes), Alternate Cuts (Extended/Director's), and Alternate Audio Tracks (Mono, Stereo, Director's Commentary), then you're generally going to find K coming up short against a typical 4K UHD/Blu-ray combo.

I would disagree on the alternate audio tracks - K usually gets those. Everything else is an uphill climb. Galleries and anything else that relies on static content, or the navigation/menu system of a BD, is a forgone conclusion due to the lack of the BD Java layer (I could count on one hand with lots of fingers left over how many times I've seen these appear.)

Ultimately, like most things, you will find heavy dependence on the publishing studio. Warner used to be the gold standard but has fallen way off the mark. Sony looked like it wanted to be the new cool uncle for a few months but then crashed. MGM has low odds, Paramount, Lionsgate, and Universal almost never. Disney is a smorgasbord of sub-labels (Marvel almost always, Pixar more often than not, pre-merger Fox was very likely but post-merger Fox is the opposite, and Disney-proper very rarely - unless it's a family/kids film and/or mega-classic.) Smaller studios also usually fall in the almost never pile.

 

[LoveCinema]

I would disagree on the alternate audio tracks - K usually gets those.

As opposed to things like 5.1 vs. Stereo, I meant the more unusual things like the original mono track on The Terminator 4K or the old dub track from Mad Max. But we also know the disc vs. digital story with immersive audio tracks like Dolby Atmos and DTS:X.

Everything else is an uphill climb. Galleries and anything else that relies on static content, or the navigation/menu system of a BD, is a forgone conclusion due to the lack of the BD Java layer (I could count on one hand with lots of fingers left over how many times I've seen these appear.)

Sure, but set aside anything like that. Just Extras. Behind-the-scenes, deleted scenes, etc. These are plentiful on disc and many are available on other digital stores. K? A fraction thereof. Spot check K titles against Apple or Fandango. Out of the Top 10 most popular titles on K, two have special features. On the other digital stores every one of the those titles is loaded.

Ultimately, like most things, you will find heavy dependence on the publishing studio. Warner used to be the gold standard but has fallen way off the mark. Sony looked like it wanted to be the new cool uncle for a few months but then crashed. MGM has low odds, Paramount, Lionsgate, and Universal almost never. Disney is a smorgasbord of sub-labels (Marvel almost always, Pixar more often than not, pre-merger Fox was very likely but post-merger Fox is the opposite, and Disney-proper very rarely - unless it's a family/kids film and/or mega-classic.) Smaller studios also usually fall in the almost never pile.

Yes, everything you said above is true... on Kaleidescape. It's not just about the studios, it's also about K. There's certainly more Extras on disc than digital, but K isn't getting the Extras that other digital stores are. K isn't getting the alternate cuts that other digital stores are. K isn't getting the movies in all of the resolutions or color grading that other stores are. That's not disc vs. digital, that's K.

When evaluating an overall package beyond the audio/video of the main feature, Kaleidescape's offerings are commonly "less" than you find elsewhere, both physically and digitally. That only matters to a (very?) small group of people, but they should be aware and plan accordingly.

 

[kedoughty]

It’s interesting. It’s been years since I’ve ripped discs to a DIY server, but in the days that I did, before owning K and then transitioning to K, I noticed the file size in the K store download and the disc versions were identical, but the disc had extras and the K store version did not. So I always had the sense that the data was in the download but K doesn’t have the rights to the content. This was all pre-4K and I’ve no idea the state of things today.

 

[Furnace Inferno]

It’s interesting. It’s been years since I’ve ripped discs to a DIY server, but in the days that I did, before owning K and then transitioning to K, I noticed the file size in the K store download and the disc versions were identical, but the disc had extras and the K store version did not. So I always had the sense that the data was in the download but K doesn’t have the rights to the content. This was all pre-4K and I’ve no idea the state of things today.

I backed up all of mine as individual MKV’s for movies and extras rather than whole discs to remove all the guff (even more time consuming to identify, select and name everything and then put into the correct folders!) and the film size reduced fairly significantly just removing any non-English languages. It’s been long enough since I last did it that I can’t give exact numbers but I think it was between 10-20GB most of the time.

 

[David23]

Yeah, Special Features are unfortunately a bit of a sour point with K. I really love extras and audio commentaries. I would say K maybe includes them for 25% of films that should have them. It makes it quite frustrating. I would prefer to buy my movies from K but when you miss out on a big part of the experience, it makes it an easy decision to purchase from a digital retailer or the physical disc. My favorite thing to do after watching a good movie is to jump into the special features or listen to what the director has to say.

 

[dnoonie]

I just bought the 1080 Blu-ray of Beetlejuice Beetlejuice for the bonus content with the digital code. The plan is to use the 1080 BD it to do a D2D upgrade to the 4k Dolby Vision version and be close to the same price as purchasing the UHD disc. This is an experiment since I don't know the D2D price of the title, it would be nice if it were listed. Unfortunately I'll still have the clutter of having a disc to manage. But this will still mean purchasing fewer discs.

 

[DLCPhoto]

I just bought the 1080 Blu-ray of Beetlejuice Beetlejuice for the bonus content with the digital code. The plan is to use the 1080 BD it to do a D2D upgrade to the 4k Dolby Vision version and be close to the same price as purchasing the UHD disc. This is an experiment since I don't know the D2D price of the title, it would be nice if it were listed. Unfortunately I'll still have the clutter of having a disc to manage. But this will still mean purchasing fewer discs.

I haven't taken advantage of it yet, but the D2D for Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice, is $4.92.

 

[LoveCinema]

I just bought the 1080 Blu-ray of Beetlejuice Beetlejuice for the bonus content with the digital code. The plan is to use the 1080 BD it to do a D2D upgrade to the 4k Dolby Vision version and be close to the same price as purchasing the UHD disc. This is an experiment since I don't know the D2D price of the title, it would be nice if it were listed. Unfortunately I'll still have the clutter of having a disc to manage. But this will still mean purchasing fewer discs.

This will certainly work as Warner has very good D2D pricing. When it comes to Disney/MGM titles this may not be as friendly a solution. I'd recommend checking out the digital code, and see if a digital version on another store will provide what you're looking for. Personally, every title I own on K I also own on Apple. I'm not as selective with the quality of Extras, so streaming works perfectly fine by me. Plus, if you're not in a hurry, you can simply track the title on Apple (or your store of choice) and wait for sales. Apple sales can often go down to $4.99, so an extra fiver for special features seems fairly reasonable to me.

 

[dnoonie]

This will certainly work as Warner has very good D2D pricing. When it comes to Disney/MGM titles this may not be as friendly a solution. I'd recommend checking out the digital code, and see if a digital version on another store will provide what you're looking for. Personally, every title I own on K I also own on Apple. I'm not as selective with the quality of Extras, so streaming works perfectly fine by me. Plus, if you're not in a hurry, you can simply track the title on Apple (or your store of choice) and wait for sales. Apple sales can often go down to $4.99, so an extra fiver for special features seems fairly reasonable to me.

Thanks for the tip! I'm not as picky with extras quality either. Yes a good alternate path with less disc clutter...if I'm patient.

 

[dnoonie]

It appears some extras are disc exclusive. I've not found an online source for the hour of bonus content on disc for "Dune Prophecy season 1".

 

[LoveCinema]

It appears some extras are disc exclusive. I've not found an online source for the hour of bonus content on disc for "Dune Prophecy season 1".

Apple has 25 special features for this series including the trailers.

But, yes, you will find discs with exclusive special features.

 

[Edgar]

I used to watch a lot of extras as well, but lately find the editorial quality of the majority of them has degraded into marketing puff pieces. I’ve got about 21 of my favorites on my Plex server, and in fact many of the best ones like Dangerous Days are on K as well.

I’m also finding that lately the best ones are not even included as disc extras but instead are independent productions released as standalone discs or YouTube releases, like Aliens Expanded and 2001: Creating Kubrick’s Odyssey.

 

[dnoonie]

I used to watch a lot of extras as well, but lately find the editorial quality of the majority of them has degraded into marketing puff pieces. I’ve got about 21 of my favorites on my Plex server, and in fact many of the best ones like Dangerous Days are on K as well.

I’m also finding that lately the best ones are not even included as disc extras but instead are independent productions released as standalone discs or YouTube releases, like Aliens Expanded and 2001: Creating Kubrick’s Odyssey.

Indeed, some extras come across as scripted, insincere and self serving. If fact I've decided not to purchase an otherwise excellent movie after watching the extras because of their trite and self serving nature. Christopher Nolan movies tend to have some of the best extras, including documentaries as well as the more typical location shoot info and scene breakdown! After souring on Marvel extras I found Guardians of the Galaxy extras to be pretty good.

 

[LoveCinema]

I've hit the point with K where I would be willing to give up on Extras completely (from K) with one single exception: Alternate Cuts. To me, these are the most important of all Extras (and are often separate titles/purchases, which I support). We're about to get Lethal Weapon in 4K HDR and I have no doubt that K will get the title. But, the disc has two cuts, I believe both are expected as part of the digital offering, and I believe there is a 0% chance that K gets both. So, the disc is ordered.

Other cuts that K is missing in 4K HDR that are readily available on other digital stores:
Almost Famous (Theatrical)
Apocalypse Now (Theatrical)
Apocalypse Now Redux
Black Hawk Down Extended Cut
Doctor Sleep Director's Cut
The Exorcist: Director's Cut
Friday the 13th (Theatrical)
Logan Black & White
The Martian: Extended Cut
Gladiator Extended Cut
Rudy Extended Cut
Rocky Balboa Director's Cut
Midsommar Director's Cut
Parasite Black & White
Rambo: Last Blood Extended Cut
Star Trek: The Motion Picture Director's Cut
Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan (Theatrical)
Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country Director's Cut
Stripes Extended Cut

And that's just a sampling. There's still more missing in HD (Commando Director's Cut, The Counselor Extended Cut, Sin City Extended, Walk the Line Extended, Rock of Ages Extended in HD is UK only, etc.). And, I'd love K to go after some things that aren't commonly found on other digital stores. Fandango (Vudu) will often get alternate cuts that even Apple doesn't get, and I wonder what else may be available. Nightmare Alley Black & White (streamed briefly on Hulu), Avatar Extended Special Edition in 4K, Rambo IV: John Rambo Cut, etc.

To me, these fall much more in line with the "Best Audio/Video Presentation" that K prides itself on. However, I totally understand that each of the above represent the same effort as adding another title, and K has to be cautious with resources. Having said that, if we saw these gaps filled and never saw another batch of deleted scenes or gag reels, I'd be ok with that trade.

 

[MarvinTheAndroid]

I've hit the point with K where I would be willing to give up on Extras completely (from K) with one single exception: Alternate Cuts. To me, these are the most important of all Extras (and are often separate titles/purchases, which I support). We're about to get Lethal Weapon in 4K HDR and I have no doubt that K will get the title. But, the disc has two cuts, I believe both are expected as part of the digital offering, and I believe there is a 0% chance that K gets both. So, the disc is ordered.

Other cuts that K is missing in 4K HDR that are readily available on other digital stores:
Almost Famous (Theatrical)
Apocalypse Now (Theatrical)
Apocalypse Now Redux
Black Hawk Down Extended Cut
Doctor Sleep Director's Cut
The Exorcist: Director's Cut
Friday the 13th (Theatrical)
Logan Black & White
The Martian: Extended Cut
Gladiator Extended Cut
Rudy Extended Cut
Rocky Balboa Director's Cut
Midsommar Director's Cut
Parasite Black & White
Rambo: Last Blood Extended Cut
Star Trek: The Motion Picture Director's Cut
Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan (Theatrical)
Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country Director's Cut
Stripes Extended Cut

And that's just a sampling. There's still more missing in HD (Commando Director's Cut, The Counselor Extended Cut, Sin City Extended, Walk the Line Extended, Rock of Ages Extended in HD is UK only, etc.). And, I'd love K to go after some things that aren't commonly found on other digital stores. Fandango (Vudu) will often get alternate cuts that even Apple doesn't get, and I wonder what else may be available. Nightmare Alley Black & White (streamed briefly on Hulu), Avatar Extended Special Edition in 4K, Rambo IV: John Rambo Cut, etc.

To me, these fall much more in line with the "Best Audio/Video Presentation" that K prides itself on. However, I totally understand that each of the above represent the same effort as adding another title, and K has to be cautious with resources. Having said that, if we saw these gaps filled and never saw another batch of deleted scenes or gag reels, I'd be ok with that trade.

Honestly, I feel that it is like flogging a dead horse although I do agree with everything you have said.

For me K has 3 glaring issues ignoring all the niggling little problems that have persisted for what seems like an eternity.

Firstly they seem to actively promote the best audio/video argument yet this is often not the case. Quite often we find titles with missing soundtracks and transfers that simply should not have passed QA such as the horrible Lethal Weapon and Breakfast Club transfers. Yes these may get corrected over time as new 4k transfers become available but this doesn't excuse the fact that the HD transfers should never of been made available in the state they were and in some cases still are especially when since then better sources have been made available on other platforms

The second and my main issue is with alternative cuts. K have said several times, and seem to promote the idea, that they aim to provide an experience as close as possible to the directors intent. Surely, at the most basic level. audio and video quality aside, this has to mean the directors preferred cut above all else. Yet time and time again these are omitted, forgotten about or just seemingly an afterthought. I sort of understand not having multiple cuts of the same movie but if this is going to be the case it should be the one cut that the director has stated is their preferred cut if they have made such a statement and if the cut is available. Presenting a cut that is not the directors preferred cut is hardly in keeping with providing an experience as close as possible to the directors intent.

Finally, and something that underpins the above points, is the issue of resources and sometimes the commercial viability of some releases. Isn't the reason why we pay such eye watering amounts for storage to provide for future developments, ongoing maintenance of the infrastructure and to subsidise the availability of content? I was astounded to read a comment a while back expressing incredulity about the sensitivity to movie prices on the store. When you are paying a significant premium for the hardware, and in particular storage, of course people aren't going to be thrilled at the prospect of paying a premium for the content. The best that K can hope for is satisfaction with price parity to other delivery channels. Rant aside, if I am paying such a large premium for the hardware I expect things like Star Trek TMP Directors Cut to be made available whether or not K are making any money on the movie or not. I simply can't believe that there isn't sufficient demand to make such a title commercially viable but that is not the point here. The point is what am I paying a premium on the hardware for if there are insufficient resources to provide such a movie? Indeed where are all the 4k K exclusives that were once bragged about but have been diminishing over time. In fact when was the last K exclusive? Are any still relevant given the rate of releases on other platforms?

Anyway, this rant shall be my last and I shall retire to the shadows in silence.

However I will say that as far as I am concerned K is a platform for people who love to watch movies not a platform for people who love movies.

If I was to go a little further I would also add that it is a great way to watch theatrical cuts of movies with an audio/video quality that is comparable with other platforms.

Toodle pip folks.