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New Sony 4K Projector

First, I generally agree with your assesment of the "upgrade" between the VW100 and the 200 (I had both as well). There were differences, and overall I do think the VW200 was an improvement over the VW100, but depending on screen size and room conditions, not all upgrades were justified, especially given the price differential.

The VPL-VW1000ES is definately worth the look. It actually is a noticeable improvement over the most recent Sony FP releases. Although 4K doesn't really "add" detail to 2K material (it cannot create something that is not there), it does make it "appear" more detailed. This is obviously a function of both the panel and the processing. Are we being fooled? Probably. But the upscaled images (2K to 4K) sure look better IMO, and the opinion of those that have seen it at a couple of demo's I did with it here.

Is it 50% better? No. 25% better? No. 10% better? Probably, and in other ways even more so, like the 3D for example. The 3D is equal to the best I've seen, and that was at more than twice the cost of the Sony. Of course all of this is subjective, and only you can determine the value of an upgrade in your system.

I viewed it in an 11.5' non-AT Stewart 2.35 AR, 1.25 gain screen, w/Isco IIIL A-lens. If you wait 45 days or so, I can tell you how it looks on a 12' AT Stewart Cinecurve 2.40, w/Isco IIIL (1.25 gain). I've ordered another Sony to try in my FL house. I'll be heading down there next month.

The lamp is a 330 wt (LMP-H330).

I cannot remember if you are a dealer, but if you need help with one of these, let me know, and I'll accommodate you on pricing.

Jim
 
Forgot to mention, the replacement lamps will be available soon. They may be advertised on the web, but my understanding is they are not yet available according to Sony.


Jim
 
cinelife said:
First, I generally agree with your assesment of the "upgrade" between the VW100 and the 200 (I had both as well). There were differences, and overall I do think the VW200 was an improvement over the VW100, but depending on screen size and room conditions, not all upgrades were justified, especially given the price differential.

The VPL-VW1000ES is definately worth the look. It actually is a noticeable improvement over the most recent Sony FP releases. Although 4K doesn't really "add" detail to 2K material (it cannot create something that is not there), it does make it "appear" more detailed. This is obviously a function of both the panel and the processing. Are we being fooled? Probably. But the upscaled images (2K to 4K) sure look better IMO, and the opinion of those that have seen it at a couple of demo's I did with it here.

Is it 50% better? No. 25% better? No. 10% better? Probably, and in other ways even more so, like the 3D for example. The 3D is equal to the best I've seen, and that was at more than twice the cost of the Sony. Of course all of this is subjective, and only you can determine the value of an upgrade in your system.

I viewed it in an 11.5' non-AT Stewart 2.35 AR, 1.25 gain screen, w/Isco IIIL A-lens. If you wait 45 days or so, I can tell you how it looks on a 12' AT Stewart Cinecurve 2.40, w/Isco IIIL (1.25 gain). I've ordered another Sony to try in my FL house. I'll be heading down there next month.

The lamp is a 330 wt (LMP-H330).

I cannot remember if you are a dealer, but if you need help with one of these, let me know, and I'll accommodate you on pricing.

Jim
Click to expand...

I'm not a dealer Jim just an avid supporter of helping manufacturers fund their up front R&D costs on new products.

This is very encouraging progress for sony. I suspect that the appearance of improved detail might be wrapped up in the increased colours available to the 4K palette but then again it could just be the koolaid ....both have always worked equally for me. :eek:

So the lamp is a lower wattage(400) than the 200 yet the lumens are brighter??
Perhaps the bulbs will be less expensive to replace......I really like the bulb up to 750 hrs and then replace for best consistent performance. Those 400W would, in my experience take an exponential nosedive after 600 hrs making calibration a nightmare. But within those parameters and limitations I must admit to loving the picture.

Thanks for the detailed response Jim you have been very helpful.......

Peter
 
nineball said:
I'm not a dealer Jim just an avid supporter of helping manufacturers fund their up front R&D costs on new products.

This is very encouraging progress for sony. I suspect that the appearance of improved detail might be wrapped up in the increased colours available to the 4K palette but then again it could just be the koolaid ....both have always worked equally for me. :eek:

So the lamp is a lower wattage(400) than the 200 yet the lumens are brighter??
Perhaps the bulbs will be less expensive to replace......I really like the bulb up to 750 hrs and then replace for best consistent performance. Those 400W would, in my experience take an exponential nosedive after 600 hrs making calibration a nightmare. But within those parameters and limitations I must admit to loving the picture.

Thanks for the detailed response Jim you have been very helpful.......

Peter
Click to expand...


The lamp info is what I received from a Sony person (I didn't see it published anywhere), and never checked the manual (a friend has that unit now, he bought it immediately after seeing it and he is unavailable to confirm. Yes, it is brighter than the 200, for sure.

I replace my lamps frequestly as well, usually at about 500 - 700 hours. Not necessary I know, but I'm an idiot that loves light.


Jim
 
There is a really nice "preview" writeup in the latest Widescreen Review. He says that in every comparison he could make, both the author and his wife preferred the 4K. I think its simply that greater pixel density will make the image look more "real".
 
Thanks Jerry, I look forward to reading that, have not had time.......

Jim
 
After being in this hobby for a little over 20 years (wow!) there are many new products that I am not really that excited by. This is one of those that really has captured my imagination because I think 4K is going to very quickly become the next generation of projector's "1080P" (remember when if you didn't have a 1080P projector or display then you weren't cool?). Im not remotely ready to ditch my projector but one day I will and when it happens its nice to know the 4K tech will be even better than this- and this is one fine beginning.
 
Yes Sir, nice to see movement in the PJ market. For now, I think 4K is more "marketing" than benefit, but these first steps are needed, and clearly you must have devices capable of playing and displaying 4K before the content is released. Once that happens, I think those of us with large displays, and large FP screens will see a noticeable benefit. I still like the smaller pixel structure, the processing (upscaling to 4K), and the 3D in this new Sony, and life will be even better once 4K material is released.


Jim
 
Absolutely. I think the improved pixel density will also displays to be larger; but also it will allow those with more limited space to sit closer, thus having a larger viewable image.
 
Hello everyone,


Sorry to hijack this thread, but since it was already talking about non-K products and it has to do with "displays" using SXRD technology, I thought I might ask... So, about 4 years ago, I purchased a new Sony SXRD rear-projection set (70" KDS-R70XBR2)... At the time, it was one of their better sets and had the largest display they made. It was going in my "Keeping room" and that room had/has tons of ambient light that is not easily controlled... I specifically bought the display because of how bright it was...

I went through one bulb at about the 3-year point, as I need to keep the light jacked up to see in the day time... Well, about 6 months ago, the display started looking not so good. It has gotten progressively worse over time... I poked around on the internet and I see that this was a common problem with Sony's SXRD rear-project sets... In fact, three of my co-workers have the 60" displays and two of the three have also had problems in a few short years... Turns out it is so common that someone put together a class-action suit against Sony... So, my question is since this is using the same underlying technology (i.e., SXRD projection), would these new 4K projectors suffer the same fate? Also, I know that Sony has made other front-project models in the past and I was wondering if you guys have ever heard of such problems?

When I contacted Sony about it today, they said that there was a "program" in which they would let one upgrade to a new LED-LCD set at about 1/2 the MSRP, directly from Sony assuming I returned the defective SXRD set... Note that my set is 4 years old, 3 years out of warrantee, and yet they extended me the offer... The offer was nice, but they only have a 60" as a replacement and that is too small for how far back we sit from the TV... In my mind, this offer is a clear indication of known issues...

Now I am on the hunt for a suitable replacement and the wall unit that this set goes in can easily accommodate a Rear-projection... The point being, the debt of the set is of no consequence... Sony no longer makes any rear projection sets... I was reading up on a Mitsubishi 75" Laserview that by reviews looks fantastic... Have any of you guys/gals ever seen one in person? I have looked everywhere to find one locally (In Atlanta and Las Vegas) but no go! I even called Mit. to see if they could direct me to a dealer in the area that carries them. Again, no go. So, I was turning to you fine folks to see if anyone has any experience or opinions. It needs to be bright and around 70-80 inches...



Matt
 
Hi Matt, we've already spoken, so I'll let others chime in here, but I did want to say that as to the Sony projector's, I have not heard of the problem you describe (I had heard of that problem w/rear proj.). I've owned 4 Sony PJ's and liked them all, no issues from any of them, other than the normal lamp decline that occurs in all PJ.s. That said, the longest I've owned any of those PJ's was 5 years, and two of them for less than 3 years.


Jim
 
Suggestion:
Ask Sony if they will go 1/2 off on this new 4K projector and include a screen and setup. :)
 
Funny thing - I actually tried that... They pretty much so no way! It was either take the "deal" on one specific model number as a replacement or forget it... I would have jumped on a 50% off on the 4K in a second, I my theatre is not even built yet...


Matt
 
What a bummer. Tell them if they can't replicate the screen size then you want a monetary payout for the retail of what you've lost.
 
I had a Sony SXRD rear projection about 5 years ago and, by some miracle, I purchased an extended warranty with my local AV boutique in the DC area. I had them swap out the optics kit when the green haze/blochiness appeared, and we were well on our way to doing it again when I noticed the SXRD class action lawsuit and brought it to the attention of my dealer. They took the TV back after two years and gave me full purchase price credit, which I used for my Pioneer Elite Kuro (still love it).

To this day, I still can't look at those Sony front projectors the same way -- keep thinking they're fundamentally flawed, although I'm sure they've made corrections since then.
 
No one could blame you for those feelings. That can happen with any product. If you get burned, it makes you snake bit for anything else they do. Thats why its so short sighted when they don't take care of customers. You'll never trust a Sony product again- or at least for a long time. I have to say that as a company they seem to be kind of not on the same page and I think the change of leadership is warranted.
 
Well, they certainly had that affect on me... I did recontact them and they will not offer any additional discounts above and beyond that one TV... The thing that really sucks is that the "replacement" is their next to the bottom of the line model and only a 60" size... As stated, the unit that died was a 70"... Well, that may certainly have an affect on my willingness to purchase one in the future...

So, we went out yesterday and picked up a new Sharp Elite 70"... Although this particular one is and LCD, it in part is based on some of the technology that was in the Kuro Elite... It has a full-array LED backlight employing local dimming and I must admit, it is by far the nicest LCD TV I have ever seen. With 240 Hz, it does an admirable job of keeping up with fast passed action. We watched Thor and Hugo last night in a darkened room and I have to tell you, there were many times where I could not Determined where the end of the screen was. The darks were that dark...

The jury is still out with regards to 3D, but we got a copy of Ice Age and tried to watch it last night... My Oppo 95's firmware was apparently out of date, and it would not play the 3D movie... So, this morning I updated the firm ware on both the TV and the Oppo... I tried to sample it this afternoon, but holly crap, seeing the sunlight sneak in around the edges of the glasses created an unacceptable shuttering... So, we are going to try it this evening...



Matt
 
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