MGM, Movies Anywhere, and Advanced CODECS

[Thrang]

Feel free to list the names of all content providers that currently offer the 4K w/HD codecs that Kaleidescape does not offer.

Jim

Not sure I'm following you Jim - aren't we all referring to 20th Century (nee Disney) and NBCU? Or are you asking something different?

Thanks

 

[cinelife]

Sorry, what I'm getting at is that we blame K for not having specific content (in this case the HD Codecs with 4K offerings from certain studios), which implies that others already have this content while K does not, so I'm asking for someone to identify that content and who is providing it. Statements being made in this thread imply that this content is available from the studios, but K doesn't want to spend the money to acquire it. I just want someone to point out a provider that has this content available right now, in the same resolution that K delivers, but with the HD Codecs that K does not offer in the Store.


Jim

 

[Thrang]

Feel free to list the names of all content providers that currently offer the 4K w/HD codecs that Kaleidescape does not offer. (I'm looking for specific example(s) of 4K titles that include the HD codecs available on disc, that another online provider has available that is not available in the K Store.)

Jim

Responding to your edited post.

There are so many, but you must know this.

One is First Man.

K 4K - DTS-HS MA 5.1
K HD - ATMOS
Disc - ATMOS
iTunes - ATMOS

Another is Alita
K 4k - DTS-HD MA 5.1
K HD - DTS-HD MA 7.1
DISC - ATMOS
iTunes - ATMOS

A third is Pacific Rim Uprising
K 4K - DTS-HS MA 5.1
K HD - ATMOS
Disc - ATMOS
iTunes - ATMOS

Jurassic Parks (plural)
no advanced codecs on K
DTS:X on disc (pretty sure on all)
ATMOS on iTunes

War for the Planet of the Apes
K 4k - DTS-HD MA 5.1
K HD - DTS-HD MA 7.1
DISC - ATMOS
iTunes - ATMOS

etc...

 

[TrackZ]

I've been privy to some detailed, direct conversation with folks at Kaleidescape in recent months. What I can say is that these are issues they are more than well aware of and would snap their fingers in an instant to resolve if they could. It doesn't boil down to a simple ask nor just writing a check, but they are trying to get these things for us. Our feedback is better spent feeding directly to Fox, NBCU, and MA on Kaleidescape's behalf than to Kaleidescape themselves.

 

[Thrang]

I've been privy to some detailed, direct conversation with folks at Kaleidescape in recent months. What I can say is that these are issues they are more than well aware of and would snap their fingers in an instant to resolve if they could. It doesn't boil down to a simple ask nor just writing a check, but they are trying to get these things for us. Our feedback is better spent feeding directly to Fox, NBCU, and MA on Kaleidescape's behalf than to Kaleidescape themselves.

Why would NBCU offer advanced codecs to K on some/several HD titles but not 4k?
Thanks

 

[TrackZ]

Why would NBCU offer advanced codecs to K on some/several HD titles but not 4k?
Thanks

I haven't asked that specific question, actually. I will do so.

 

[cinelife]

Understood, and yes, I do know that, but I'm looking for the same video quality as well. My point (admittedly not well made), is that there isn't another provider that matches K's video quality and that also has the HD codecs.

Jim

 

[TrackZ]

Understood, and yes, I do know that, but I'm looking for the same video quality as well. My point (admittedly not well made), is that there isn't another provider that matches K's video quality and that also has the HD codecs.

Jim

Just discs. There is no other digital provider, at this time, with higher bit rate video or lossless audio, let alone the combination of the two.

 

[Thrang]

Understood, and yes, I do know that, but I'm looking for the same video quality as well. My point (admittedly not well made), is that there isn't another provider that matches K's video quality and that also has the HD codecs.

Jim

Appreciate that, but thats not the gist of the issue.

The primary comparison is to UHD's. We know only K offers UHD quality video as a download service (through frankly Apple is getting to within 85-90% of the quality on average with their streaming codec)

If someone were considering KScape, they are UHD disc buyers not (primarily)Netflix or iTunes or whatever streamers. So the proper comparison is to UHD.

 

[cinelife]

I realize some of this doesn't make sense, but it isn't K driving this train. As TrackZ mentioned, we should direct comments to the Studios.

(Forgot to mention in my last comment that just because iTunes has some of this content, doesn't mine K will get it, I think we can all agree that iTunes probably gets favorable treatment, more obvious reasons.)

Jim

 

[Thrang]

I simply ask why would these studio agree to let K sell their content, their highest quality (video) content cheerfully, but for some reason tuck the advanced codecs in the crotch of their pants. Of course I agree I don't know that it's a cost issue, but as I approach 60 years old, you sir of know what the aroma is when a certain whiff passes by...

 

[cinelife]

Okay, you win, iTunes is the better solution for you and others that find the current situation unacceptable. Probably better to sell the K gear and stick with iTunes.

Jim

 

[Thrang]

Okay, you win, iTunes is the better solution for you and others that find the current situation unacceptable. Probably better to sell the K gear and stick with iTunes.

Jim

Where did I say iTunes was better? I just said the most proper comparison IMO was K to UHD discs

 

[adidino]

I've been privy to some detailed, direct conversation with folks at Kaleidescape in recent months. What I can say is that these are issues they are more than well aware of and would snap their fingers in an instant to resolve if they could. It doesn't boil down to a simple ask nor just writing a check, but they are trying to get these things for us. Our feedback is better spent feeding directly to Fox, NBCU, and MA on Kaleidescape's behalf than to Kaleidescape themselves.

I've had several discussions with K on this topic as well. As it was explained to me, it is a technical issue on the KScape side and not the studios holding out on the content. However, I've been told this several times since May of this year and again earlier this month. The last update I received was "very soon" on the advanced codecs. Although I'm not holding my breath at this point.

Would love to see this happen as it is a bit of a shortcoming for the product. Overall I'm very happy with my Kscape system but this is a gap that needs to be filled make it complete.

 

[Thrang]

I've had several discussions with K on this topic as well. As it was explained to me, it is a technical issue on the KScape side and not the studios holding out on the content. However, I've been told this several times since May of this year and again earlier this month. The last update I received was "very soon" on the advanced codecs. Although I'm not holding my breath at this point.

Would love to see this happen as it is a bit of a shortcoming for the product. Overall I'm very happy with my Kscape system but this is a gap that needs to be filled make it complete.

Since the actual lack of advanced codecs for these two studios stretches much further back than May (two years or more), it seems no longer likely this could still be a technical issue.

It would be better for K to just say straight-up, publicly, what is happening. I think owners and prospective buyers have a legitimate reason to know.

 

[TrackZ]

I had some dialog with Kaleidescape about this over the past few days.

Ultimately, despite the length of time this gap has been open, it appears to remain a process issue. It's very clear they want this gap closed as much as any of us. If Kaleidescape had the immersive audio assets from those studios combined with the UHD/HDR video assets, us owners would have them as well.

As mentioned, our feedback is better sent to Fox and NBCU home entertainment divisions than to Kaleidescape. There's not anything else Kaleidescape can do other than continue to work with the studios. They are actively engaged, but not to the point of making a definitive announcement.

I've been 20+ years in automotive and commercial desktop software development and been through a lot of business and release process. Sometimes business action and technology seem like they should be very simple on the outside, but there can be complexities. Even when a process or piece of technology works in one area, it doesn't always automatically apply to all areas. It's especially true in dealing with third-party dependencies.

NBCU can be reached on both Twitter and FaceBook:

NBCUniversal (@NBCUniversal) | Twitter

The latest Tweets from NBCUniversal (@NBCUniversal). The official Twitter account of NBCUniversal. 30 Rockefeller Plaza

twitter.com

NBCUniversal | New York NY

NBCUniversal, New York, New York. 76,898 likes · 51 talking about this. The official account of NBCUniversal. https://www.nbcuniversal.com/

www.facebook.com

Fox provides a few contact options:

20th Century Fox (@20thcenturyfox) | Twitter

The latest Tweets from 20th Century Fox (@20thcenturyfox). Welcome to the Official Twitter page for 20th Century Fox. Super See #SpiesInDisguise Now Playing in theaters. Get tickets now!

twitter.com

Foxmovies

Foxmovies. 859 likes. Personal blog

www.facebook.com

support@foxcustomercare.com
888-223-4369

I suggest we all actively message them, clearly state the issue we have with their content in this platform, and ask for them to take action in making a solution. Reach out across all of those media types.

 

[Thrang]

I had some dialog with Kaleidescape about this over the past few days.

Ultimately, despite the length of time this gap has been open, it appears to remain a process issue. It's very clear they want this gap closed as much as any of us. If Kaleidescape had the immersive audio assets from those studios combined with the UHD/HDR video assets, us owners would have them as well.

As mentioned, our feedback is better sent to Fox and NBCU home entertainment divisions than to Kaleidescape. There's not anything else Kaleidescape can do other than continue to work with the studios. They are actively engaged, but not to the point of making a definitive announcement.

I've been 20+ years in automotive and commercial desktop software development and been through a lot of business and release process. Sometimes business action and technology seem like they should be very simple on the outside, but there can be complexities. Even when a process or piece of technology works in one area, it doesn't always automatically apply to all areas. It's especially true in dealing with third-party dependencies.

NBCU can be reached on both Twitter and FaceBook:

NBCUniversal (@NBCUniversal) | Twitter

The latest Tweets from NBCUniversal (@NBCUniversal). The official Twitter account of NBCUniversal. 30 Rockefeller Plaza

twitter.com

NBCUniversal | New York NY

NBCUniversal, New York, New York. 76,898 likes · 51 talking about this. The official account of NBCUniversal. https://www.nbcuniversal.com/

www.facebook.com

Fox provides a few contact options:

20th Century Fox (@20thcenturyfox) | Twitter

The latest Tweets from 20th Century Fox (@20thcenturyfox). Welcome to the Official Twitter page for 20th Century Fox. Super See #SpiesInDisguise Now Playing in theaters. Get tickets now!

twitter.com

Foxmovies

Foxmovies. 859 likes. Personal blog

www.facebook.com

support@foxcustomercare.com
888-223-4369

I suggest we all actively message them, clearly state the issue we have with their content in this platform, and ask for them to take action in making a solution. Reach out across all of those media types.

Thanks for the reply, and not being confrontational at all, but I'm more confused than ever.

By "process", I infer contractual/financial, not technical. It cannot take two years of technical alignment to get the advanced codecs to K and uploaded (and in fact NBCU does provide this codecs already to K, but for some reason on HD titles only). Its just ...not...possible. If the studios were not K providers at all and needed to adopt their workflow, that could take some technical time (but regardless, months, not two years) But both studios already use K workflows, so...

I'll certainly do my part to let the studios know, but I read your post as this are nowhere remotely close to happening with either studio - to suggests a few K Scape users posting in FB to Twitter will help this process is strongly indicative of that. Something truly further along would be far beyond a modest user plea campaign.

Remember, I was told multiple times this year by a Kscape employee, (who has since been promoted!) that the audio codecs were in K's hands and were being uploaded... then a small glitch.... then being uploaded.... then next week.... then the week after... then etc.etc.etc...

You can appreciate where I and others who heard similar things sense a huge disconnect on this issue.

Thanks again.

 

[Thrang]

So I wrote this to Fox

Hi

I am an owner of the Kaleidescape Movie Server systems and download service, of which 20th Century is a partner. (https://www.kaleidescape.com/movie-store/collection/fox)

But for more than two years, the 4K HDR movies you make available to Kaleidescape are missing advanced audio codes (Dolby ATMOS or DTS:X), where they otherwise exist on the equivalent physical UHD purchase. Instead they are limited to 7.1 or even 5.1 lesser quality audio for some unknown reason.

I am writing to please urge 20th Century to work with Kaleidescape to get this rectified for all existing and upcoming titles. I cannot fathom why Fox would contract with Kaleidescape to provide the best possible video quality of their films, only to cripple the audio. For example, see the enclosed screen shot for Alita: Battle Angel



Not only is the ATMOS track missing from the UHD version of the movie (which is how the disc and other streaming services offer it), it somehow offers even a worse quality soundtrack than the HD version (5.1 vs 7.1) Regardless, this and many others suffer the same limitation

Thanks for passing this along to the appropriate teams and hope to hear some positive news soon

Thanks


For NBCU

@NBCUniversal
As an active partner with the premier movies sales service, https://kaleidescape.com/movie-store/collection/nbcuniversal…, please rectify the issue where your 4K titles are missing ATMOS/DTS:X codecs (which exist on disc). Best video quality marred by subpar audio. It's been an issue for 2 years! TY!

 

[Ahmad78]

I've had several discussions with K on this topic as well. As it was explained to me, it is a technical issue on the KScape side and not the studios holding out on the content. However, I've been told this several times since May of this year and again earlier this month. The last update I received was "very soon" on the advanced codecs. Although I'm not holding my breath at this point.

Would love to see this happen as it is a bit of a shortcoming for the product. Overall I'm very happy with my Kscape system but this is a gap that needs to be filled make it complete.

+1 that’s the most gab All K user want it to resolve and I have faith in 2020 will have some gift from K and happy new year to all K society

Ahmed


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[steelman1991]

C'mon K we know you have a presence here and monitor these threads - what about at least providing an official response and explanation. Notwithstanding there may be some NDA in place (though that doesn't seem to be the case with other posters having active dialogue on the issue).

.......................... and Happy New Year to all posters and K employees.